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Help Save 1.800.SUICIDE


Cingular Wireless: Need help from anyone who has dialed a number and been blocked

by rcs1

Read Todd Johnston's followup on this story...he interviewed Cingular, Freeconference and checked out FCC regs: Cingular AT&T Blocking Calls. Aaron Barlow also explains his "ultimate solution, given ATT's attitude "We Don't Care. We're the Phone Company. We Don't Have To"

If you have tried to make a call to any number at all and found it blocked by your telephone company, particularly cell phone companies, please comment here, or if you prefer, contact me (my email address is on my user profile).

What would help would be having the numbers that are blocked.

Apparently, Cingular and perhaps other cell phone companies are blocking numbers for commercial reasons. So we would like to know the names of the companies that are having their numbers blocked and the types of business they are in.

What we have found so far is that Cingular is blocking at least those companies providing free conference calling services.


commentary :: :: :: buzz-it!
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to know if it is ever blocked, but I have had experience with calls being blocked...

At my mom's in N. Central Montana ... I was not able to call the 800 number to pay my credit card bill over the phone -- couldn't even access Customer Service.  I got the message "this number is not available from this area code".  I had a similar experience after moving to Hawaii.  Both times I was able to use my cell phone (Verizon Wireless -- 503 area code) to place the calls.

by roxy317 on Sun Mar 11, 2007 at 10:15:00 PM EST

FreeConference.com is owned by Integrated Data Concepts, LLC who has a "co-branded relationship" with TelePacific Communications. TelePacific has this to say about themselves:

"TelePacific is the largest competitor to AT&T, Verizon and Embarq in its markets..."

But this is the part that makes Ed Whitacre's forehead veins visibly throb. TelePacific boasts:

  • "915 miles of metro fiber"
  • "1,412 miles of statewide fiber"
  • "25,000 fiber strand miles"

Ooo, how Ed hates companies with their own fiber. All those years AT&T had to let anyone who asked use their wire for FREE, and now that AT&T is finally back to together...all these little companies now have their own, faster infrastructure.

"To the politician and a priest
We're in the belly of the beast
Because we fed it"

Amos Lee, "Freedom"

by Todd Johnston on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 02:31:12 AM EST
question.  Going back a few steps via the phone companies buyout/merge.........was someone in the justice department involved/approved the buyout/merge? And if so, who?  Were there hearings?

My pea brain tells me that DOJ is the center of the universe for Corporations via Bushco.....we just gotta keep digging/hammering......... Maybe finding out if a political appointee is involved...... I don't know just musing.......

by avahome on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:13:46 AM EST

Actually poked around on this for a minute or two after the call yesterday and found this analysis of the business of free conference calling in area code 712. Might lend some additional background as to Cingular's motive for blocking the calls.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
by wanderindiana on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 02:41:25 PM EST
working my way up the Cingular ladder for an answer. So far, they're providing nothing more substantive than the clause in the standard service agreement that says they have the right to classes of numbers, e.g. 900 & 976.

The third level mgr is going to call me back tomorrow after trying to find out more information. I told him if he calls back and can't provide more info, it would be wise to have the number of someone else for me to contact.

FYI, I'm now convinced this is what it appears to be. The 641 area code covers a large portion of Iowa and I don't believe they've blocked it entirely. The 297 exchange, however, seems to be largely reserved for teleconferencing -- I think that is what they've blocked.

Finally, I'm also pretty sure I know how AT&T is going to try and get away with this. The service agreement states:

"We may block access to certain categories of numbers (e.g. 976, 900 and certain international destinations) or certain web sites if, in our sole discretion, we are experiencing excessive billing, collection, fraud problems or other misuse of our network."

However, all 3 people to whom I spoke quoted from the same missive from on high, that explicitly cited the examples in the service agreement -- "e.g. 976, 900" -- but additionally specified chat services, a category NOT mentioned in the agreement above.

AT&T is going to try and claim free teleconferencing qualifies as "chat rooms," because the services are offered via a web-based interface.

"To the politician and a priest
We're in the belly of the beast
Because we fed it"

Amos Lee, "Freedom"

by Todd Johnston on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 06:42:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
with whoever owns FreeConference.com. I'm sure they'd have both an interest and theory on why this would be the case.

"To the politician and a priest
We're in the belly of the beast
Because we fed it"

Amos Lee, "Freedom"

by Todd Johnston on Sun Mar 11, 2007 at 11:27:37 PM EST
The article quoted below is available in full at FreeConference.com's web site.

"Teleconferencing spurs more excited talk"

By Jon Van
Tribune staff reporter
Published August 8, 2004

Here's the basic idea:

"In 2003, when most telecom industry indicators pointed downward, teleconferencing was up 10 percent worldwide, said Marc Beattie, a senior partner with Wainhouse Research in Boston..."

"Smaller firms have prospered in part because the long-distance companies that traditionally dominated teleconferencing--AT&T Corp., MCI Inc., Sprint Communications Co. and Global Crossing--have been preoccupied with falling long-distance rates, regulatory problems and shrinking revenues." [emphasis added]

So, is it in Cingular's financial interest to block its customers from using free VOIP teleconferencing services? Absolutely. The only question is whether they're powerful enough to get away with it.

For those who are unaware, Cingular Wireless was formed in 2001 as a joint venture of BellSouth and SBC Communications ("SBC" stands for "Southwestern Bell Corporation," NOT to be confused with BellSouth Corporation. BellSouth and SBC were 2 of the original 9 independent local-exchange companies resulting from the Bell System divestiture in 1984). One result of former-President Bill Clinton's conciliatory and devastating Telecommunications Act of 1996 is that AT&T has nearly reassembled itself.

For example, after the industry was deregulated, from 1996-98 SBC acquired 3 of the divested companies: Pacific Telesis, SNET, and Ameritech. Then in 2001, BellSouth and SBC merged their wireless divisions to form Cingular.

Meanwhile, back in 2000, AT&T Corp. had taken its wireless services division public as "AT&T Wireless," and the following year spun it off as a separate company. However, in 2004 AT&T Wireless put itself on the auction block and was eventually acquired by Cingular.

Now, recall that Cingular was owned in a 60-40 split between SBC and BellSouth and that SBC (including itself) had consolidated 4 of the 9 divested companies. So in 2005, when SBC acquired AT&T Corp they managed to reassembled 5/9 of the original AT&T, and owned 60% of AT&T Wireless (through Cingular). If there was any doubt about SBC's intent, shortly after the acquisition they renamed to AT&T, Inc.

The coup de grace came in 2006, when AT&T, Inc was allowed to acquire BellSouth. The merger essentially meant that 6 of the 9 independent local-exchange companies, created to break up AT&T's monopoly in 1984, were now owned by AT&T, Inc. In addition, AT&T who had sold off its entire wireless division just 2 years earlier, had reacquired 100% of it, along with the rest of Cingular Wireless' network and customers.

On January 15, 2007, AT&T officially began phasing out the Cingular brand, in favor of an as yet unannounced variant of "AT&T."

"To the politician and a priest
We're in the belly of the beast
Because we fed it"

Amos Lee, "Freedom"

by Todd Johnston on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 02:08:19 AM EST
Suggest you contact whoever has teleconference responsibilities on campus.  Out here they've been running IP video/ teleconferencing for years.  

by rba on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 08:58:15 AM EST
but I think the issue is that Cingular is blocking it's customers ability to call some phone numbers.  

by standingup on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 09:50:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"shop" on campus was (is?) resonsible for setting up all comm - including conferencing.  Just suggesting that people organizing and setting up teleconferencing for the past (roughly) twenty years may have some insight.

by rba on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:21:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
...isn't with the teleconferencing, but with Cingular, which has decided to block all calls into the teleconferencing service.  They told me it was a "business decision."

People phoning using other telephone services have no trouble.

by Aaron Barlow on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:12:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

that narrows down the parameters.

. . .If you have tried to make a call to any number at all . . .

by rba on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:32:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

As someone who is involved in telecommunications I believe there are two bad guys here.

-ATT/Cingular

-Greedy Local Telephone Companies in Iowa and FuturePhone.



Some background.

All telephone companies in the USA, local and long distance, “hand off” traffic to each other in order to make the phone system work.

When the “hand off” is made, the carrier who is accepting the call is paid, a few pennies per minute to complete the call from the company originating the call.



In some parts of the country, this “fee” (known as a reciprocal compensation) is just a few tenths a penny per minute.

In theory, most companies should pay as much to connect calls, as they get paid to complete calls.

In practice however, some small phone companies earn a few dollars to complete the calls.



In the case of the Iowa companies, more calls were placed TO their ustomers rather than their customers placing calls outside of the local area.

This is totally legal and  long ago was sanctioned by the courts and the FCC.



In Iowa, due to the rural nature of the state, the rate the local companies are paid by ATT, MCI and other long distance carriers to accept and complete calls  is sometimes as high at 5-cents per minute.



However, the companies named in the lawsuit, decided to ignore the regulated 5-cents per minute fee  and charged up to 14-cents per minute.



After several months, ATT, MCI and others became aware of this situation and stopped paying the fees altogether.(Payments stopped in January 2007.



FuturePhone was the main culprit, despite claiming the mantle of “friend of the consumer”The owner gave numerous interviews with newspapers and even appeared on the ABC Evening News and urged callers to essentially beat ATT at their own game (e.g.) “Don’t pay for an international phone call ever again”

ATT naturally looked into FuturePhone and stopped payments to the local Iowa phone companies, which were handling all the incoming calls to FuturePhone.



If FuturePhone had “kept a low profile” ATT would NOT have had a legal case against them.

If the local phone companies had accepted the regulated “connection fee” they were normally paid, they would NOT be in legal hot wate.



FuturePhone and the Iowa phone companies decided to “take a chance” and swing for the fences and earn alot money together. Instead of a home run, they struck out.



Eventually the lawsuits will be settled.

-ATT and others will NOT pay amounts larger than 5-cents per minute to the local Iowa phone companies.

-ATT will NOT pay any money to the Iowa phone companies for any calls made to a FuturePhone Number.

-The local phone companies will agree to abide by the rules in the future, and instead of making millions and millions of dollars on connect fees, they may earn “just a few million”



Capitalism works. Greed never does.





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by bobnsri on Sun Mar 18, 2007 at 09:29:50 PM EST

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